I agree with the much more sane and effective approach that is in place for youth sports- a paradigm that in the best of worlds would be universally adopted in the US.
I coordinated MLB’s International coaching programs 1998- 2011 and have experience in Norway as well as friends in both the ex-pat and local youth sports areas.
In Ice hockey, soccer and baseball there is a shift in attitude and expectations once the scoreboard is introduced- and not the continuation of the all of the tenets that you have mentioned.
I do not have analytical data - only first hand experience related to me by my acquaintances.
Unfortunately the win at all cost mentality oozes into sport - thankfully not at the same level as so often seen in the US.
I enjoy and look forward to your continued sharing of top notch information.
Just getting started on “The Way of Excellence “
Cheers
Their foundational approach Thankfully , seems to keep a much healthier overall culture alive.
I think of my own experience as a youth. I LOVED baseball, and in the backyard, I was amazing. My Dad signed me up for little league. I couldn't hit, I couldn't field, the pressure to win was crazy. I failed, and I quit.
I gravitated toward running, simply because I could do it, even competitively, maybe fail, but it wouldn't affect anyone but me. Personal failure was fine, but failing my team, in front of everyone, was devastating.
Funny how this was 50+ years ago and I still remember it today.
I have had kids get really down on themselves because they miss tackles or they drop balls. I always make sure to speak to them when I see it (and I always see it, kids wear their hearts on their sleeves) - there is always something they have done right, even if it is only stepping on the pitch when others decided not to, and I point them to that. That is what a coach should do.
I live in a ski focused academy community. Unless your family is rich, it’s almost impossible for kids to learn and compete in Alpine skiing. Skis, tuition, travel is about $60-100K/ year. This eliminates a large pool of talent. The numbers may vary at other less elite communities but I doubt it’s much different.
It gets worse when it’s time for college. The European kids come, get full scholarships pushing American skiers out. Then they go home and compete having gotten free education in skiing and a degree.
This takes me back to coaching my daughter's 1st grade track team. I had the audacity to mix it up and put the slowest girl last on a shuttle relay. She couldn't hold on for the W and one of the pissed off Grandma's said, "Everyone knows you put the fastest girl last".
Your post seems to mix few solid ideas with a lot of hand-waving and vibe based analysis.
Start with the elephant in the room. Take Norway vs. Sweden vs. Finland. Similar climate, wealth, social democracy, winter culture, etc. Yet Norway wildly outperforms them in Winter Olympic medals. That alone raises some questions. If “no scorekeeping until 13” were the secret sauce, Sweden would be drowning in olympic medals. But they aren’t.
What Norway actually has is a very specific ecosystem. Heavy cultural emphasis on outdoor life from childhood. Extremely strong club systems tied into national federations. Serious talent identification in skiing and biathlon. Deep technical coaching pipelines. And in winter sports especially, generational infrastructure. It's similar to how a tiny country like New Zealand dominates rugby union (a sport I am more familiar with).
Now, are some of the claims partially true? Yes. Early overspecialization is a real issue in some American sports. The research on burnout and overuse injuries is not imaginary. The “pay to play” model absolutely distorts access for many. Those are legit issues to raise.
But the idea that not keeping score until 13 is the key to producing Johannes Thingnes Bo or Marit Bjorgen is fantasy. Norway becomes extremely competitive once kids hit their teens. Selection pressure ramps up. Training volumes go up. Standards get sharp. They are not producing world champions by accident or by vibes.
The “fun vs winning” framing is also a bit childish. Kids don’t hate competition. They hate humiliation, favoritism, and adult insanity. There’s a difference. In wrestling rooms and rugby clubs overseas, kids absolutely compete hard from young ages. But the adults tend to understand long-term development. That’s a coaching culture issue, not a scoreboard issue.
On the Summer Olympics point, the per-capita comparison is clever but misleading. Small, wealthy nations can dominate per capita because they concentrate resources into niche sports with low participation barriers. See Japan and womens wrestling as a example. It doesn’t mean their youth sport philosophy is universally superior. It means they are efficient.
And here’s the uncomfortable part: America’s “mess” still produces an absurd number of elite athletes across a massive range of sports. The U.S. Olympic medal totals are not exactly tragic, especially when compared with larger nations such as China and India. The pipeline is chaotic, yes. But it is also ferociously competitive and talent-rich.
You stated that "Norway also wins three-times the medals as the US at the Summer Olympics too." I looked at Olympics.com and I can see the current medal table as it stands right now in Italy.
If I'm reading it right, in Paris 2024, the US had 112 total medals and Norway had 8. But maybe that's a bogus site for stats?
I totally agree with the spirit of what you were saying in the rest of the article, but it doesn't look like the stats you gave at the very beginning match up to the current all-time medal counts. Maybe there are some other stipulations like medals per capita or something. Or maybe I mis-read your intro.
Nope -- you were right and I was wrong. I meant to write "per capita" and somehow I left it out. Thanks for calling me out on this. I've just updated the intro to reflect what I meant all along!
I coach an U10 rugby team. If I feel the team are getting too intense, and a little too focused on winning above anything else I remind them "why do we do this? we do it because it is fun. Yes, winning feels good but if you feel miserable while winning, what is the point?". Ironically, contra the "win at all costs" coaches we come across frequently, a focus on having fun and enjoying what they do has led them to really lean into training and taking pleasure from their growing confidence in the sport.
I am going to need some help understanding the point about Norway's performances at the summer Olympics as a quick Google search shows that they have not outperformed the Americans?
Probably worth clarifying "per capita" in that sentence. First paragraph says that they have the most in Milan (absolute count) and only have a population of 5.6m, but the next sentence you don't mention per capita.
I agree with the much more sane and effective approach that is in place for youth sports- a paradigm that in the best of worlds would be universally adopted in the US.
I coordinated MLB’s International coaching programs 1998- 2011 and have experience in Norway as well as friends in both the ex-pat and local youth sports areas.
In Ice hockey, soccer and baseball there is a shift in attitude and expectations once the scoreboard is introduced- and not the continuation of the all of the tenets that you have mentioned.
I do not have analytical data - only first hand experience related to me by my acquaintances.
Unfortunately the win at all cost mentality oozes into sport - thankfully not at the same level as so often seen in the US.
I enjoy and look forward to your continued sharing of top notch information.
Just getting started on “The Way of Excellence “
Cheers
Their foundational approach Thankfully , seems to keep a much healthier overall culture alive.
Thank you for sharing your experience from the frontlines, Pat.
I love the Norwegians!
1) keep it acessable;
2) Try a bunch of different sports;
3) Keep it joyful.
I think of my own experience as a youth. I LOVED baseball, and in the backyard, I was amazing. My Dad signed me up for little league. I couldn't hit, I couldn't field, the pressure to win was crazy. I failed, and I quit.
I gravitated toward running, simply because I could do it, even competitively, maybe fail, but it wouldn't affect anyone but me. Personal failure was fine, but failing my team, in front of everyone, was devastating.
Funny how this was 50+ years ago and I still remember it today.
I have had kids get really down on themselves because they miss tackles or they drop balls. I always make sure to speak to them when I see it (and I always see it, kids wear their hearts on their sleeves) - there is always something they have done right, even if it is only stepping on the pitch when others decided not to, and I point them to that. That is what a coach should do.
You didn't fail at little league, your coach did.
I live in a ski focused academy community. Unless your family is rich, it’s almost impossible for kids to learn and compete in Alpine skiing. Skis, tuition, travel is about $60-100K/ year. This eliminates a large pool of talent. The numbers may vary at other less elite communities but I doubt it’s much different.
It gets worse when it’s time for college. The European kids come, get full scholarships pushing American skiers out. Then they go home and compete having gotten free education in skiing and a degree.
This takes me back to coaching my daughter's 1st grade track team. I had the audacity to mix it up and put the slowest girl last on a shuttle relay. She couldn't hold on for the W and one of the pissed off Grandma's said, "Everyone knows you put the fastest girl last".
First grade. That Grandma needs to get a life.
Your post seems to mix few solid ideas with a lot of hand-waving and vibe based analysis.
Start with the elephant in the room. Take Norway vs. Sweden vs. Finland. Similar climate, wealth, social democracy, winter culture, etc. Yet Norway wildly outperforms them in Winter Olympic medals. That alone raises some questions. If “no scorekeeping until 13” were the secret sauce, Sweden would be drowning in olympic medals. But they aren’t.
What Norway actually has is a very specific ecosystem. Heavy cultural emphasis on outdoor life from childhood. Extremely strong club systems tied into national federations. Serious talent identification in skiing and biathlon. Deep technical coaching pipelines. And in winter sports especially, generational infrastructure. It's similar to how a tiny country like New Zealand dominates rugby union (a sport I am more familiar with).
Now, are some of the claims partially true? Yes. Early overspecialization is a real issue in some American sports. The research on burnout and overuse injuries is not imaginary. The “pay to play” model absolutely distorts access for many. Those are legit issues to raise.
But the idea that not keeping score until 13 is the key to producing Johannes Thingnes Bo or Marit Bjorgen is fantasy. Norway becomes extremely competitive once kids hit their teens. Selection pressure ramps up. Training volumes go up. Standards get sharp. They are not producing world champions by accident or by vibes.
The “fun vs winning” framing is also a bit childish. Kids don’t hate competition. They hate humiliation, favoritism, and adult insanity. There’s a difference. In wrestling rooms and rugby clubs overseas, kids absolutely compete hard from young ages. But the adults tend to understand long-term development. That’s a coaching culture issue, not a scoreboard issue.
On the Summer Olympics point, the per-capita comparison is clever but misleading. Small, wealthy nations can dominate per capita because they concentrate resources into niche sports with low participation barriers. See Japan and womens wrestling as a example. It doesn’t mean their youth sport philosophy is universally superior. It means they are efficient.
And here’s the uncomfortable part: America’s “mess” still produces an absurd number of elite athletes across a massive range of sports. The U.S. Olympic medal totals are not exactly tragic, especially when compared with larger nations such as China and India. The pipeline is chaotic, yes. But it is also ferociously competitive and talent-rich.
Just curious where you’re getting your medal count data.
Olympics.com
You stated that "Norway also wins three-times the medals as the US at the Summer Olympics too." I looked at Olympics.com and I can see the current medal table as it stands right now in Italy.
However, here is this: https://www.olympedia.org/statistics/medal/country
If I'm reading it right, in Paris 2024, the US had 112 total medals and Norway had 8. But maybe that's a bogus site for stats?
I totally agree with the spirit of what you were saying in the rest of the article, but it doesn't look like the stats you gave at the very beginning match up to the current all-time medal counts. Maybe there are some other stipulations like medals per capita or something. Or maybe I mis-read your intro.
Nope -- you were right and I was wrong. I meant to write "per capita" and somehow I left it out. Thanks for calling me out on this. I've just updated the intro to reflect what I meant all along!
I coach an U10 rugby team. If I feel the team are getting too intense, and a little too focused on winning above anything else I remind them "why do we do this? we do it because it is fun. Yes, winning feels good but if you feel miserable while winning, what is the point?". Ironically, contra the "win at all costs" coaches we come across frequently, a focus on having fun and enjoying what they do has led them to really lean into training and taking pleasure from their growing confidence in the sport.
Norway really invested in its athletes. Something we (USA) need to do more of.
I am going to need some help understanding the point about Norway's performances at the summer Olympics as a quick Google search shows that they have not outperformed the Americans?
2012
US: 104
Norway: 4
2016
US: 121
Norway: 4
2020
US: 113
Norway: 8
2024
US: 126
Norway: 8
I wrote per capita. The US as 330 million people. Norway is 5.6 million. In 2020 and 2024 Norway, per capita, outdid the States by a long shot.
Probably worth clarifying "per capita" in that sentence. First paragraph says that they have the most in Milan (absolute count) and only have a population of 5.6m, but the next sentence you don't mention per capita.
yeah, I just addressed this up above. I messed up and somehow left it out. It was not intended. It's since been corrected!
Thank you. You know we’re reading carefully!